BEEST mode

[rockeroo]

Time to explore! Results to come...

Cheers.

[melodichaotic]

Will do more substantial testing tomorrow, but with a quick run through today just with the Beest for some perspective, I still stand by my contention that with some added low mids, and about 15-20% increase in gain, yet still with the nature knob voiced as it is, I think it will be a killer overdrive...especially for the price.

It doesn't have that characteristic honk of the Deluxe(or HB for that matter), but so what...something different would be a bit cooler.

It only sounds thinner because of the leanness of the low mids...the slice and sting would be nicely balanced with a stouter low end..as I said the SYOD V1 has even more upper end slice than the Beest.

Having said that, like Alan seems to concur, I think(again initially) the best tones are with the nature knob from about 10:30 to fully CCW...there it doesn't sound thin, but that slice helps preserve the definition and character of the Beest, and this is where it sounds closer to what many may imagine what it might sound like, albeit with a bit more modern "healthy output transformer" quality to the drive.

From my vantage point, I'm not as a big fan of stacking as many are here, as I tend to like an want to exploit the individual quality and character of each pedal, and I don't like to have to "fix" a short coming with another pedal if something is lacking..certainly no offense to anyone, as we all roll a bit differently, and there are many ways to skin a cat to get good tone(brutal imagery, but you get the point)...not that I've had any literal experience


Again, initial impressions, but I don't think the Beest is far off from being something special and more unique than just Bee-ing a clone of the Deluxe Bee, or even just a "caramelized" hybrid SYOD/Bee. It's got it's own thing going on that I want to further familiarize myself with.

Steve..thanks for the supportive words, and glad I could Bee of assistance...the Beest isn't going anywhere, however as you well know that Model R, R-arely surfaces these days

Rockeroo, as mentioned, I will try to get some reasonable sounding demo comps with the Beest side by side with the Deluxe Bee, SYOD, and others over the next few days.

More to follow...

[rockeroo]

I have never enjoyed playing my EGDM so much! The BEEST totally rocked it -- stung it, even. Here's my stack:

AC30 > Big Box DMM > EGDM > BEEST > Tele / SG / Strat

EGDM:
Volume 9:00
Voice 1:00
Distortion 11:00
Trimmer backed off about 25%

BEEST:
Volume 10:00
Nature (or whatever the BEEST knob is called) 9:30
Drive 2:00

AC30 settings at the bottom of the post.

Talk about a fantastic telecaster tone! The EGDM fattens up the BEEST and the BEEST livens the EGDM. They complement one another so well, and the voicing of the BEEST improves my recollections of the EGDM > HBOD stack. The added upper-mid focus and reduced bottom end results in a well-rounded, heavily driven drive that sings wonderfully. It can go from rhythm to lead by adjusting tone knobs or choosing pups. You can almost enter into fuzz-land by pushing the EGDM a little harder with the BEEST. I could really notice the EGDM and AC30 perking up with the BEEST on.

I am pretty sure jdandry would get a kick out of this with his tele rig. The sting of these tones is incredible, and the clarity is making me really happy. The BEEST is so darn amp-like AND quiet! I completely agree with the other three on those regards. You can access all the gain you need without much buzz (but Bees like buzzing!) at all.

Have any of the other 3 guys (or Donner) tried the BEEST with a tele (better yet, with an EGDM as well)? I think they were meant to be together. I have no complaints about this tone whatsodeviever. Thanks! More explorations to come.

I meant to stack the BEEST with other drives, but I could not put this duo down. I have a to-do list for tomorrow night, I guess.

(keep reading if you are interested in my ramblings about my AC30 settings or about my OTHER New favorite stack)

...

AC30 settings:
Back of the amp: "Vintage" Output Bias & "Modern" Smoothing
Normal channel: Volume 9:00 & Bright switch engaged
Top Boost channel: Volume 10:00, Treble 1:30, Bass 10:00 & "Standard EQ"
Master: Tone (cut) 1:30 (to run a more traditional AC30 set-up, run the tone around 9:00) & Volume 8:30 (the amp character is maintained up through about 10:00 on the master volume)

These settings lend a nice, warm, clean base tone that loves pedals (at least ones I have tried). The EGDM, of course, loves this amp, and so does the lively BEEST.

...

OTHER New favorite Stack:
MHvTv2 > BBODv1

This combo blows me away. I already love the MH as my favorite high gain pedal when playing live. I am always pleased with the tone I get wherever I am at. Sliding the BBOD in before the MH allows me to drop the Drive on the MH and run the BBOD slightly hot (Volume 2:00, Tone 3:00 & Drive 1:30), pushing the MH to where it needs to be. To my ear, this stack is massive for any style of heavy rock. Then again, rolling back our little friend, the volume knob, brings the stack back down to earth.

Has anyone else tried this stack before? I am floored by it!

I will copy this text to a separate post for responses. Cheers, again!

[scottcw]

From my vantage point, I'm not as a big fan of stacking as many are here, as I tend to like an want to exploit the individual quality and character of each pedal, and I don't like to have to "fix" a short coming with another pedal if something is lacking..

Agreed. A pedal should be able to stand by itself. I don't want to add mids or reduce highs by stacking.

[voxdefiant]

This pedal STRAIGHT through a pro JR. or any Amp I've tried yet is ILL. It is just not a mid emphasizing pedal, and to me that is why it sounds SO AMP LIKE, and so different from a strong shaping
pedal like a SYOD, or others. The similarity with SYOD is that it has some sparkle, but not artificial sparkle. Anyone else feeling this? I've tried it through maybe 4 Different amps now, but I've really dug the results. I am a music therapist, and used the Beest at work all day, through a Pro Jr., and it the pedals sounded absolutely great by itself, and seemed especially versatile when turning the volume down on the guitar, a Wonderful clean sound ensued. Then Volume all the way up, Grunchy.
Also as stated by others the tone controls really come alive. I think this Beest is a real winner. Thoughts? Differences of opinion?

[rockeroo]

From my vantage point, I'm not as a big fan of stacking as many are here, as I tend to like an want to exploit the individual quality and character of each pedal, and I don't like to have to "fix" a short coming with another pedal if something is lacking..

Agreed. A pedal should be able to stand by itself. I don't want to add mids or reduce highs by stacking.

Not sure I meant to say the BEEST "needs" to be stacked to sound good; rather, it sounds amazing on its own and equally amazing when stacked with something else. If the BEEST (or any pedal, for that rather) did not sound good on its own, I would not own one.

I understand some people aren't stackers, but I, personally, enjoy the nuance of a particular stack -- in this case, EGMD > BEEST.

Cheers.

[melodichaotic]

From my vantage point, I'm not as a big fan of stacking as many are here, as I tend to like an want to exploit the individual quality and character of each pedal, and I don't like to have to "fix" a short coming with another pedal if something is lacking..

Agreed. A pedal should be able to stand by itself. I don't want to add mids or reduce highs by stacking.

Not sure I meant to say the BEEST "needs" to be stacked to sound good; rather, it sounds amazing on its own and equally amazing when stacked with something else. If the BEEST (or any pedal, for that rather) did not sound good on its own, I would not own one.

I understand some people aren't stackers, but I, personally, enjoy the nuance of a particular stack -- in this case, EGMD > BEEST.

Cheers.

To clarify, scottcw merely agreed with what I stated, and quoted an excerpt from the whole passage that I posted:

From my vantage point, I'm not as a big fan of stacking as many are here, as I tend to like an want to exploit the individual quality and character of each pedal, and I don't like to have to "fix" a short coming with another pedal if something is lacking..certainly no offense to anyone, as we all roll a bit differently, and there are many ways to skin a cat to get good tone(brutal imagery, but you get the point)...not that I've had any literal experience


Just being definitive, nothing personal, and that certainly doesn't imply that I don't stack at all either, I'm just focusing on the pedal on it's own merits.

On that note, as Donner mentioned about corroborating our impressions, I think it's good that you're doing what you're doing and being detailed about how your using it, and as a result, you are being definitive which is cool..BTW, did you get the PM I sent you on your request to hear the Deluxe Bee and SYOD's?

[melodichaotic]

So, Rocker and Vox seem to be bonding quite well with the Beest and finding some positive results. I would like to hear some more from Alan, especially since he has a Model G to comp it with.

I spent some considerable time and critical listening today with the Beest by itself, and comp'd with:

Deluxe Bee
Model G
SYOD V1
SHOD(one of 10 hand-wired by Jukka from a schematic that Bjorn gave him)

To update, here's what I found:

I still stand by by original impression that the Beest needs some lower mids to balance out it's voicing, and about 15-20% more gain
would bring it on par with the Deluxe Bee.
As I also particularly mentioned, the voicing of the nature knob is such that for me without question the best, most complete tones are found with N set from about 11:00/10:30-9:00/8:30.

This is where the strong upper mid voicing is offset by the introduction of more bass frequencies, and where it just sounds more balanced.

On that note when you nudge the Nature knob forward post 11:00, yes it does open up..there to noon, and then from noon to full CW where it further brings on the sting, and opens up even more which is very cool.

However, post 11 on N and you lose those lower frequencies, and that openness is not supported by some ample lower mids, and this is where the pedal sounds just plain thin...and I back that up with my own ears, the fact that I'm using hotter humbuckers, and that against all the other aforementioned pedals that I comp'd the Beest with, that is what it is.

Just calling a spade a spade as I hear it, nothing more, nothing less. Conversely, I hear that happening openness that occurs from post 11:00 on N, and I know the added lower mids will absolutely create the authoritative vibe that I want to hear with the Beest throughout that range of the pot.

SYOD V1 is a good example...a similar type openness occurs from about 10-noon on the treble knob, and then it pours on the slice from there, but even when I had the treble maxed, it may have sounded quite bright, but not thin because the lower mids were there.

Here's something else I zoned in on...my initial impressions were that the Beest was like a SYOD dipped in honey, and I think the "leanness" of it's overall EQ structure gives it less of a Honey Bee sound and is more like the SYOD in that manner,

However when I comp'd it with the Model G(D-maxed, N-3:00, C-maxed), and the SHOD(drive and focus maxed), I heard the overdrive character and qualities closer to these two pedals moreso than the SYOD, both with single notes and chords, up and down the neck.

I have had the Model G for quite a long time, so I'm very familiar with it(as well I have a '57 GA 40, and have owned four other of these amps, so I know very well what Bjorn was going for when he voiced this), and it's got that characteristic bark to the grind at the setting mentioned(mainly because the C-control maxed, fully focuses the mid/upper mids and immediacy of the attack response) that I also hear in the Beest because it's drive emphasis is so focused, and I think this may be what Rocker and Vox are digging so much.

Here, I would say also that the Beest's gain is slightly hotter than these two, but again, not as hot as the SYOD and Deluxe Bee.

Regarding the Deluxe Bee, when I had the Deluxe's Nature at 9:00, and the Beest's at 9 as well(again drives maxed), I found the lower frequency emphasis quite similar(compressed, looser low end), and this is where I find the Beest sounds most like a Bee, albeit with a lot more clarity at this setting than the Deluxe.

Focusing on these two, the Deluxe is darker overall...even when I left the Beest at this setting, but cranked the nature knob fully CW on the Deluxe Bee, thus losing it's bottom end, the Beest was still more pronounced than the Deluxe.

Here's where I'd like to illustrate a related point...I feel even with added lower mids and a bump in gain, the Beest will sound more Bee like,

but not like the Deluxe...the Deluxe has an overall looser feel, is more "slushy" and "mushy" in the best way possible, due to it's characteristic sag of course, where at lower nature knob settings the frequencies seem seem to shift around a bit like tectonic plates.

The Beest however, because of it's brighter, more modern voicing, with some added gain and lower mids, also introducing more compression characteristics(and thus more dynamics/range on the drive knob), would bring it closer to the Deluxe, but because the drive focus is so pronounced on the Beest, I think it will end up acting as a "frequency stabilizer", as the lower frequencies "shift" about, and this is where I think the Beest could sound incredibly happening!


Just to clarify, I am purposely trying to reduce the many variables that exist, as I am using the same guitar/pick-ups, through just the one dual triode channel of my Matchless, same Matchless cab with mismatched Matchless voiced Celestion 25 watt and 30 watt speakers, EQ set flat(Bass and treble at noon), volume level consistent, etc, etc to let these details and nuances more easily reveal themselves.

Having said that, I think how Rocker and Vox are approaching it gives the research a different angle and decidedly different approach(playing through different amps, guitars, stacking pedals, playing through darker settings or rolling back tone knobs), and that diversity is a good thing.

Personally, I'm already looking further down the road, as Donner mentioned about doing tweaks to the circuit, and doing more research(where's a teleporter when you need one so we can all do this in real-time... ), re-evaluating, re-testing, and that's where I might broaden the scope of my approach, and focus on more variables as the Beest gets further dialed in.

Lastly, maybe by early next week, I can get some demos together to flesh-out some of these findings, because talking about sound after a while for me just hits a dead end, and I would encourage Vox, Alan, and Rocker to do the same.

[Bobby D]

this is very interesting...

[alanbarley]

It's great to hear everyone's impressions of the Beest. Last night I took it with me to play at my regular Friday night gig in a church sanctuary that seats 800 people with about 150 there last night. I used my Badcat Classic Cat. This amp is a loud 20 watts using 6v6s with a strong emphasis in the lower mids, with chime but not as much as my 65 Ams London head. The amp has a vol, tone, and verb control and starts to open up at noon with just a hint of breakup. I'm using a PRS 5310.



I'm using my BJF board with the Toneczar delay and phase.



For me the best way to evaluate a pedal sometimes is to plug it into my chain and play live with it. I like seeing how each pedal stands on its own and live I always end up leaving the MG on all the time with the gain to 9-10. It just sweetens everything. Last night I spent a lot of time stacking the Beest into the G and running it alone and toggling between the Hv1 and the G separately.

With this darker amp in a room with great acoustics my view of the pedal is changing. When toggling between each pedal you notice drop in the low end when getting to the Beest but the brightness of the pedal turns out to allow my guitar to cut through more in the band mix. Adding the G in warms up the sound a bit but I didn't mind using the Beest alone. I still liked the nature settings all the way CCW to about 11 and played most of the night with the gain at noon but a few times maxed it.

So......big open string chords with the guitar volume on full still rang out with articulation with a bright top end but nothing fizzy. Some of the brightness was tamed with a twist on the tone knob but I wasn't minding it. Power chords crunched and still remained open. When the music quieted down the guitar still cleaned up well with the beest's gain on at noon and the guitar volume pulled back. At one point I engaged the PRS's tap and backed up on the volume and felt I was playing a strat slightly overdriven. With guitar on 10 I could solo fine but would of liked a little more sustain. At that point I kicked the G on and then the RRB to boost and was fine.

When I have two or three drives plus an HB or G on a board I can usually use any of them with a few adjustments depending on the room, the guitar, the amp, and whatever mood I'm in at the moment. With five amps and four different boards I find it helpful and fun on a frequent basis to take totally different setups to gigs and with a few tweaks make them work for me. Keeps me from getting to comfortable.

Yes the pedal is different than the others but I'm now thinking its a good thing. I'd like to see a little more low end and with the gain maxed I could of used a little more in that department too. With the nature knob CCW all the way to the left I wished I could turn a bit further to the left. But I ended up liking the way the beest helped my guitar cut through with a little more crunchy top end and played most of the night with it on either alone or stacked.

I do agree with Melodichaotic about discussing tone in words. So I'm digging into some quick ways to do some audio demos over the next couple of days and put a few of these pedals side by side. I'm enjoying how everyone experiences this pedal and I'll continue digging into it more.

Thanks,

Alan