Sooooo.... I may have just bought a Model R

[cajone5]

Wow, thanks for all that info Donner! Cool story.

So, you would recommend running the R pre-buffer then? Right now I have a T1M buffer at the front of the chain and then the Model R is the 2nd-to-last OD pedal (right before the Honeybee). I could put the R first I guess, but I really like setting it to medium gain (around 10 O'Clock) and then driving it with the RRB.

I guess I should pull it back off the board and see if the R knob is working differently without the buffer.

While you're at it try the DRD off the board without a buffer too. I really disliked the DRD the first time I tried it. However, the second time around I realized that if I use it without a buffer it sounds much more dynamic, thicker and less harsh. I'd recommend a thorough comparison of any/all your pedals pre- and post-buffer to find out what works best. I've realized recently that a lot of my bad experiences in the past with BJFe pedals were due to my T1M buffer being placed in the wrong spot in the signal chain.

This is actually probably the reason I didn't get along with the MR I used to own ... if only I knew then what I know now...

[Joeleo]

Thanks! Yeah I generally experiment pre- and post-buffer when I get a new pedal. Sometimes i can really hear a difference, sometimes not.

The thing that always confuses me is that I can really start to hear a difference if I don't place the buffer 1st or 2nd in the chain. And then, if I have a couple OD pedals (and whatever fuzz pedals) that sound better without a buffer, then they need to go before it, and then the buffer would be 4th or 5th in the chain...

[cajone5]

Thanks! Yeah I generally experiment pre- and post-buffer when I get a new pedal. Sometimes i can really hear a difference, sometimes not.

The thing that always confuses me is that I can really start to hear a difference if I don't place the buffer 1st or 2nd in the chain. And then, if I have a couple OD pedals (and whatever fuzz pedals) that sound better without a buffer, then they need to go before it, and then the buffer would be 4th or 5th in the chain...

Maybe get some better/different cables? Or you could try your hand at building the folk buffer that allows you to tweak the input and output impedance (IIRC) so you can tune it to work for your guitar and your effects

[Donner]

Yup on dynamic pedals, buffers and cords are going to influence the sound and feel....
I usually put my buffer post dirt for this reason ... I like the RRB pre dirt and the BPB post dirt for this reason....
And I think this is the reason I love the sound of Cornish pedals but not the feel ... and why BJFs sound good into Cornish but not the other way around...buffers.

Oh the R sounds really good blowing out the HB btw or vice versa

[Joeleo]

So I took the R off the board last night and played through it a bit with just guitar->R->amp, and y'all were right that the 'R' dial works COMPLETELY differently without the buffer. It is actually a really amazing control in how it can subtly dial things in, it sounded to me like the mids on the CCW side of the pedal are more of a 'growl', and on the CW side they're more 'biting', if that makes any sense. I guess I am going to have to reconfigure things and figure out how to get the buffer in a different spot on the board.

[Joeleo]

Oh the R sounds really good blowing out the HB btw or vice versa

YES! My favorite stack for leads at the moment is RRB -> Model R (set for med. gain) -> HB (set @ unity w/ almost no gain)

[cajone5]

So I took the R off the board last night and played through it a bit with just guitar->R->amp, and y'all were right that the 'R' dial works COMPLETELY differently without the buffer. It is actually a really amazing control in how it can subtly dial things in, it sounded to me like the mids on the CCW side of the pedal are more of a 'growl', and on the CW side they're more 'biting', if that makes any sense. I guess I am going to have to reconfigure things and figure out how to get the buffer in a different spot on the board.

Yep -- I hated the R when I tried it... but I tried it post buffer and never thought anything of it.

Dumb dumb dumb

Maybe one day I'll get my chance to try it again...

I'm starting to realize in a lot of cases what a huge effect buffer placement can have on your overall sound. Most specifically with fuzz/distortion/OD. The placement of buffers totally changes the dynamics and tone of a lot of my pedals (DRD is a big one -- pre buffer - thick and awesome post buffer - thin and harsh). I've learned to really take my time experimenting with new pedals because a lot of times it takes a while to really figure out where it fits best into a rig (placement in the drive chain, pre-post buffer, etc.). Even something as small as pick choice can change tone. I would have called BS on that before but recent experience with the Fetto has changed my mind about that. Anyway, sorry to get off topic Glad you're finding some new tones in the MR. It's quite a unique pedal with very interesting controls.

[Donner]

yupper...and to make it worse not all buffers are created equal

[cajone5]

yupper...and to make it worse not all buffers are created equal

Ain't that the truth. So far the only one I've really liked is the buffer in the BPB side of the HBOD Deluxe. Couldn't get the T1M to work for me despite all the great reviews. It just didn't "feel" right with my drives. Now if only some company could make a SBEQ with the BPB buffer in it...


hint hint

[SteveA]

LOL! SBEQ DLX ??? I'd be in for it too!! Add a little Mid control as well and you've got my dream end-of-chain pedal right there! Please Bjorn